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Re: [Fwd: Re: cross-modality-size-loud]

First, there should be no confusion between pitch and timbre.  If an
object has more than one modal frequencies, a percept of pitch only
brought about when the frequencies of the components are harmonic.  In
principle, it is possible that modal frequecies can go up on average,
but that in the new configuration a lower fundamental frequency arises. 
Second, an example of counterintuitive rising of modal frequencies with
size is increasing the thickness of a plate.  Due to the higher
stiffness of thicker plates their resonance frequencies are higher.
Some informal demonstrations I gave during lecturing shows that the
human listener is indeed fooled by this and, based on their sounds when
hit, judges the thicker plates as "smaller" than the thinner plates.
Detailed studies about size and speed perception of rolling balls can be
found in the theses by Marc Houben en Christophe Stoelinga, and the
papers they published and will publish.  Loudness only plays a minor
role in this.  

> -----Original Message-----
> From: AUDITORY - Research in Auditory Perception 
> [mailto:AUDITORY@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Peter Lennox
> Sent: maandag 17 september 2007 12:35
> To: AUDITORY@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: [AUDITORY] [Fwd: Re: cross-modality-size-loud]
> Is there likely to be some pitch-with-resonance component? - 
> ie, larger objects have longer 'intrinsic reverberation' 
> (body resonance) than smaller, other things being equal 
> (material, etc) - and this actually tends to be lower, for 
> larger objects regards ppl
> Dr. Peter Lennox
> S.P.A.R.G.
> Signal Processing Applications Research Group University of 
> Derby http://sparg.derby.ac.uk Int. tel: 3155
> >>> Bob Carlyon <bob.carlyon@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> 17/09/2007 11:10 >>>
> -------- Original Message -------- Subject: Re: 
> cross-modality-size-loudDate:
> Mon, 17 Sep 2007 09:56:55 +0100From: Jan Schnupp 
> <jan@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>Reply-To:
> Jan Schnupp <jan@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>To: 
> AUDITORY@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx:
> <001101c7f8bd$b7f802a0$3364f94d@Woonkamer>
> Dear Peter,
> if you hit a large bell and a small bell, how loud they are 
> does not depend on size, but on how hard you hit them. The 
> larger the object the deeper the sound, because resonant 
> frequency is proportional to mass. So if there is a link with 
> size, then it should be pitch more than loudness. 
> Jan
> On 17/09/2007, pieter jan stallen <pj.stallen@xxxxxxxxx> 
> wrote: Dear List,Does anyone know of  experimental 
> psychological data reported which refutes (or not) the 
> hypothesis: the perception of object O as "has much of quality X"
> predisposes to the perception also of "has much of quality 
> Y"? E.g., is there empirical evidence for cross-modal bonds 
> like "large objects (much of size) are loud objects (much of 
> sound)" ? Although I see brain research approaching the 
> subject (e.g.  http://www.dhushara.com/pdf/synesthesia.pdf ) 
> I have not (yet) found so much empirical psychology about 
> such metaphors. I may not have studied carefully enough the 
> synaestesia literature, but appreciate any more specific 
> 'forwardings' then.Pieter Jan Stallen / Chair Community Noise 
> Annoyance / University of Leiden / Netherlands
> --
> Dr Jan Schnupp
> University of Oxford
> Dept. of Physiology, Anatomy and Genetics Sherrington 
> Building - Parks Road Oxford OX1 3PT - UK
> +44-1865-272513
> www.oxfordhearing.com
> -- Dr. Bob CarlyonMRC Cognition & Brain Sciences Unit15 
> Chaucer Rd.Cambridge
> CB2 7EFEnglandPhone: +44 1223 355294 ext 651Fax:   +44 1223
> 359062www.mrc-cbu.cam.ac.uk
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