Re: need recommendation on PC sound card (Neil Waterman )


Subject: Re: need recommendation on PC sound card
From:    Neil Waterman  <neil.waterman@xxxxxxxx>
Date:    Mon, 22 Feb 2010 10:49:06 -0500
List-Archive:<http://lists.mcgill.ca/scripts/wa.exe?LIST=AUDITORY>

--Apple-Mail-25-783737333 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; delsp=yes; format=flowed You can get closer... With a good professional mic (with low self-noise) and something like =20= my FireStudio mobile I can get 101dB dynamic range. Anyway have fun folks. - Neil On Feb 22, 2010, at 10:35 AM, Pawe=C5=82 Ku=C5=9Bmierek wrote: > > > On 22 February 2010 10:30, Neil Waterman <neil.waterman@xxxxxxxx=20 > usa.com> wrote: > As for immunity to PC noise I'm sorry I disagree. Try running an =20 > internal sound card and making a 24-bit recording that really uses =20 > the full 24-bit range... good luck. > > Well I doubt that any device, external or internal, can even =20 > approach 144dB dynamic range in its analog path. :-) > > > I guess it depends what you are trying to do really. > > Definitely. > > Pawel > > > > > > On Feb 22, 2010, at 10:10 AM, Pawe=C5=82 Ku=C5=9Bmierek wrote: > >> Hi Rob, >> >> for most uses any sound card from the semi-pro market should be =20 >> sufficient. Look for manufacturers such as M-Audio, E-mu, Lexicon, =20= >> PreSonus, MOTU, Tascam), or simply go to an online store such as =20 >> http://www.sweetwater.com, http://www.musiciansfriend.com, http://=20 >> www.zzounds.com/, and look for recording interfaces. Any of these =20 >> should support 44.1-48 kHz at 16-bit with stereo line level input =20 >> and output, but if you need more inputs or outputs, another kind =20 >> of output (mic preamp, instrument level, headphone), analog volume =20= >> controls, higher sampling rates or bit depths, then there will =20 >> still a lot of options, but read the specs. >> >> As for external vs. internal - these days decent internal cards =20 >> are usually very immune to PC noise it I would not say it's an =20 >> issue. On the other hand, USB cards in some (rare) configurations =20 >> may have a little trouble running smoothly, Firewire cards are =20 >> reported to be more reliable. I took me some time to get my M-=20 >> Audio FastTrack Pro (a USB card) to run without glitches, whereas =20 >> none of M-Audio PCI interfaces gave me any problems. On the other =20 >> hand, external interfaces' audio connections are usually easier to =20= >> connect - the box in your desk and you don't have to work behind =20 >> your computer (some PCI cards have external breakout boxes =20 >> though). Fore some people, an advantage of USB cards is that they =20 >> tend to have manual analog volume controls and mic preamps. >> >> Hope that helps, >> >> Pawe=C5=82 >> On 22 February 2010 09:07, Neil Waterman <neil.waterman@xxxxxxxx=20 >> usa.com> wrote: >> Hi Rob, >> >> Is there a particular reason you need an INTERNAL card? Generally =20 >> the internal environment of a PC is not conducive to high quality =20 >> sound (far too many sources of electric and magnetic fields for =20 >> the analog audio stages to remain clean). A much better option =20 >> would be an external USB soundcard. Since these units keep the =20 >> analog audio outside of the PC chassis things generally go rather =20 >> better. Whether there are any external units that provide SDK =20 >> support is beyond my knowledge though. >> >> FWIW I am current using a PreSonus Audiobox USB and like it a lot. >> >> Regards, Neil >> >> >> On Feb 21, 2010, at 7:12 PM, G. Robert Arrabito wrote: >> >>> Dear listers, >>> >>> I did a quick search on the last two years of the auditory =20 >>> mailing list archives on pc sound card recommendations and =20 >>> didn't find much on the topic so hence my post to the list. I am =20= >>> looking for recommendations for an internal PC high quality sound =20= >>> card that will be used to output auditory stimuli in my =20 >>> experiments. Would also be nice if there is an accompanying =20 >>> software development kit. Any suggestions are greatly =20 >>> appreciated. Thanks. >>> >>> >>> Rob >>> >>> -- >>> G. Robert Arrabito, M.Sc. >>> Defence Scientist | Scientifique de la d=C3=A9fense >>> Advanced Interface Group | Groupe des interfaces avanc=C3=A9es >>> Human Systems Integration | Section de l'int=C3=A9gration humain-=20 >>> syst=C3=A8mes >>> Defence R&D Canada Toronto | R&D pour la D=C3=A9fense Canada Toronto >>> 1133 Sheppard Ave West , PO Box 2000 | 1133 Ave Sheppard Ouest, =20 >>> C.P. 2000 >>> Toronto, ON M3M 3B9 Canada >>> >>> Robert.Arrabito@xxxxxxxx >>> Telephone | T=C3=A9l=C3=A9phone (416) 635-2033 >>> Facsimile | T=C3=A9l=C3=A9copieur (416) 635-2013 >>> >>> Government of Canada | Gouvernement du Canada >>> >>> www.drdc-rddc.gc.ca >>> >> >> > > --Apple-Mail-25-783737333 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 <html><body style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; = -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; ">You can get = closer...<div><br></div><div>With a good professional mic (with low = self-noise) and something like my FireStudio mobile I can get 101dB = dynamic range.</div><div><br></div><div>Anyway have fun = folks.</div><div><br></div><div>- Neil</div><div><br><div><div>On Feb = 22, 2010, at 10:35 AM, Pawe=C5=82 Ku=C5=9Bmierek wrote:</div><br = class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline"><blockquote type=3D"cite"><br><br> = <div class=3D"gmail_quote">On 22 February 2010 10:30, Neil Waterman = <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a = href=3D"mailto:neil.waterman@xxxxxxxx">neil.waterman@xxxxxxxx</a>&= gt;</span> wrote:<br> <blockquote style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid; = MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; PADDING-LEFT: 1ex" class=3D"gmail_quote"> = <div style=3D"WORD-WRAP: break-word"> <div>As for immunity to PC noise = I'm sorry I disagree. Try running an internal sound card and making a = 24-bit recording that really uses the full 24-bit range... good = luck.</div></div></blockquote> <div>&nbsp;</div> <div>Well I doubt that = any device, external or internal, can even approach 144dB dynamic range = in its analog path. :-)</div> <div>&nbsp;</div> <div>&nbsp;</div> = <blockquote style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px = 0.8ex; PADDING-LEFT: 1ex" class=3D"gmail_quote"> <div style=3D"WORD-WRAP: = break-word"> <div>I guess it depends what you are trying to do = really.&nbsp;</div></div></blockquote> <div>&nbsp;</div> = <div>Definitely.</div> <div>&nbsp;</div> <div>Pawel</div> = <div>&nbsp;</div> <div>&nbsp;</div> <div>&nbsp;</div> <div>&nbsp;</div> = <blockquote style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px = 0.8ex; PADDING-LEFT: 1ex" class=3D"gmail_quote"> <div style=3D"WORD-WRAP: = break-word"><br> <div> <div class=3D"im"> <div>On Feb 22, 2010, at 10:10 = AM, Pawe=C5=82 Ku=C5=9Bmierek wrote:</div><br></div> <blockquote = type=3D"cite"> <div class=3D"im"> <div>Hi Rob,</div> <div>&nbsp;</div> = <div>for most uses any sound card from the semi-pro market&nbsp;should = be sufficient. Look for manufacturers such as M-Audio, E-mu, Lexicon, = PreSonus, MOTU, Tascam), or simply go to an online store such as <a = href=3D"http://www.sweetwater.com/" = target=3D"_blank">http://www.sweetwater.com</a>, <a = href=3D"http://www.musiciansfriend.com/" = target=3D"_blank">http://www.musiciansfriend.com</a>, <a = href=3D"http://www.zzounds.com/" = target=3D"_blank">http://www.zzounds.com/</a>, and look for recording = interfaces. Any of these should support 44.1-48&nbsp;kHz at 16-bit with = stereo line level input and output, but if you need more inputs or = outputs, another kind of output (mic preamp, instrument level, = headphone), analog volume controls, higher sampling rates or bit depths, = then there will still a lot of options, but read the specs.</div> = <div>&nbsp;</div> <div>As for external vs. internal - these days decent = internal cards are usually very immune to&nbsp;PC noise it I would not = say it's an issue. On the other hand, USB cards in some (rare) = configurations may have a little trouble running smoothly, Firewire = cards are reported to be more reliable. I took me some time to get my = M-Audio FastTrack Pro (a USB card) to run without glitches, whereas none = of M-Audio PCI interfaces gave me any problems. On the other hand, = external interfaces' audio connections are usually easier to connect - = the box in your desk and you don't have to work behind your computer = (some PCI cards have external breakout boxes though). Fore some = people,&nbsp;an advantage of USB cards is that they tend to have manual = analog volume controls and mic preamps.<br> </div> <div>&nbsp;</div> = <div>Hope that helps,</div> <div>&nbsp;</div> = <div>Pawe=C5=82<br></div></div> <div class=3D"gmail_quote"> <div = class=3D"im">On 22 February 2010 09:07, Neil Waterman <span = dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:neil.waterman@xxxxxxxx" = target=3D"_blank">neil.waterman@xxxxxxxx</a>&gt;</span> = wrote:<br></div> <div> <div></div> <div class=3D"h5"> <blockquote = style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; = PADDING-LEFT: 1ex" class=3D"gmail_quote"> <div style=3D"WORD-WRAP: = break-word"> <div><span style=3D"TEXT-TRANSFORM: none; TEXT-INDENT: 0px; = BORDER-COLLAPSE: separate; FONT: 12px Helvetica; WHITE-SPACE: normal; = LETTER-SPACING: normal; COLOR: rgb(0,0,0); WORD-SPACING: 0px">Hi = Rob,</span></div> <div><br></div> <div><span style=3D"TEXT-TRANSFORM: = none; TEXT-INDENT: 0px; BORDER-COLLAPSE: separate; FONT: 12px Helvetica; = WHITE-SPACE: normal; LETTER-SPACING: normal; COLOR: rgb(0,0,0); = WORD-SPACING: 0px">Is there a particular reason you need an INTERNAL = card? Generally the internal environment of a PC is not conducive to = high quality sound (far too many sources of electric and magnetic fields = for the analog audio stages to remain clean). A much better option would = be an external USB soundcard. Since these units keep the analog audio = outside of the PC chassis things generally go rather better. Whether = there are any external units that provide SDK support is beyond my = knowledge though.</span></div> <div><br></div> <div><span = style=3D"TEXT-TRANSFORM: none; TEXT-INDENT: 0px; BORDER-COLLAPSE: = separate; FONT: 12px Helvetica; WHITE-SPACE: normal; LETTER-SPACING: = normal; COLOR: rgb(0,0,0); WORD-SPACING: 0px">FWIW I am current using a = PreSonus Audiobox USB and like it a lot.</span></div> <div><br></div> = <div><span style=3D"TEXT-TRANSFORM: none; TEXT-INDENT: 0px; = BORDER-COLLAPSE: separate; FONT: 12px Helvetica; WHITE-SPACE: normal; = LETTER-SPACING: normal; COLOR: rgb(0,0,0); WORD-SPACING: 0px">Regards, = Neil &nbsp;</span></div> <div> <div></div> <div> <div><br></div><br> = <div> <div>On Feb 21, 2010, at 7:12 PM, G. Robert Arrabito = wrote:</div><br> <blockquote type=3D"cite"> <div style=3D"MARGIN: = 0px">Dear listers,</div> <div style=3D"MARGIN: 0px; MIN-HEIGHT: = 14px"><br></div> <div style=3D"MARGIN: 0px">I did a quick search on the = last two years of the auditory mailing list archives<span>&nbsp; = </span>on pc sound<span>&nbsp; </span>card recommendations and didn't = find much on the topic so hence<span>&nbsp; </span>my post to the list. = I am looking for recommendations for an internal PC high quality sound = card that will be used to output auditory stimuli in my experiments. = Would also be nice if there is an accompanying software development kit. = Any suggestions are greatly appreciated. Thanks.</div> <div = style=3D"MARGIN: 0px; MIN-HEIGHT: 14px"><br></div> <div style=3D"MARGIN: = 0px; MIN-HEIGHT: 14px"><br></div> <div style=3D"MARGIN: 0px">Rob</div> = <div style=3D"MARGIN: 0px; MIN-HEIGHT: 14px"><br></div> <div = style=3D"MARGIN: 0px">--</div> <div style=3D"MARGIN: 0px">G. Robert = Arrabito, M.Sc.</div> <div style=3D"MARGIN: 0px">Defence Scientist | = Scientifique de la d=C3=A9fense</div> <div style=3D"MARGIN: = 0px">Advanced Interface Group | Groupe des interfaces avanc=C3=A9es</div> = <div style=3D"MARGIN: 0px">Human Systems Integration | Section de = l'int=C3=A9gration humain-syst=C3=A8mes</div> <div style=3D"MARGIN: = 0px">Defence R&amp;D Canada Toronto | R&amp;D pour la D=C3=A9fense = Canada Toronto</div> <div style=3D"MARGIN: 0px">1133 Sheppard Ave West , = PO Box 2000 | 1133 Ave Sheppard Ouest, C.P. 2000</div> <div = style=3D"MARGIN: 0px">Toronto, ON M3M 3B9 Canada</div> <div = style=3D"MARGIN: 0px; MIN-HEIGHT: 14px"><br></div> <div style=3D"MARGIN: = 0px"><a href=3D"mailto:Robert.Arrabito@xxxxxxxx" = target=3D"_blank">Robert.Arrabito@xxxxxxxx</a></div> <div = style=3D"MARGIN: 0px">Telephone | T=C3=A9l=C3=A9phone (416) = 635-2033</div> <div style=3D"MARGIN: 0px">Facsimile | T=C3=A9l=C3=A9copieu= r (416) 635-2013</div> <div style=3D"MARGIN: 0px; MIN-HEIGHT: = 14px"><br></div> <div style=3D"MARGIN: 0px">Government of Canada | = Gouvernement du Canada</div> <div style=3D"MARGIN: 0px; MIN-HEIGHT: = 14px"><br></div> <div style=3D"MARGIN: 0px"><a = href=3D"http://www.drdc-rddc.gc.ca/" = target=3D"_blank">www.drdc-rddc.gc.ca</a></div> <div style=3D"MARGIN: = 0px; MIN-HEIGHT: = 14px"><br></div></blockquote></div><br></div></div></div></blockquote></di= v></div></div><br></blockquote></div><br></div></blockquote></div><br></bl= ockquote></div><br></div></body></html>= --Apple-Mail-25-783737333--


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