Subject: Re: psychoacoustically driven temporal approximation From: "Richard F. Lyon" <dicklyon@xxxxxxxx> Date: Wed, 5 Mar 2014 08:05:59 -0800 List-Archive:<http://lists.mcgill.ca/scripts/wa.exe?LIST=AUDITORY>--20cf3010e48d54cef704f3de32af Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Alberto, the question is not clear. When you say "in the time domain" do you mean you are looking for alternatives to the widely used perceptual audio coders that use filterbanks? If "a spectral-weighted temporal approximation method" is what you want, don't try to "connect frequency components to specific samples in the time domain". Frequency components are not a relevant concept in the time domain. Possibly what you want is something like LPC whitening with residual coding. See for example: Singhal, Sharad. "High quality audio coding using multipulse LPC." *ICASSP*, 1990. Dick On Tue, Mar 4, 2014 at 3:05 AM, JesterN Alberto Novello <jestern77@xxxxxxxx>wrote: > Hi all, > i'm trying to find a way to approximate the sample values of an audio > waveform in time domain. > I want a method that takes care of approximating perceptually-relevant > audio bands better than others. > Basically a spectral-weighted temporal approximation method. > In my head it's not clear how to connect frequency components to specific > samples in the time domain. > Any DSP wizard out there with a good idea/papers ? > Best regards > Alberto > > || | | ||| | || || | ||||| || | || | ||| | ||||| | | ||| | |||| | || > |||| > > ALBERTO NOVELLO / JesterN > site: jestern.com > shop: jestern.bandcamp.com > audio: soundcloud.com/jestern > video: vimeo.com/jestern > > || | | ||| | || || | ||||| || | || | ||| | ||||| | | ||| | |||| | || > |||| > > If for any reason you wish not to receive any more messages from this > email, please send an email with REMOVE as subject. I'm sorry for the > inconvenience. > Se per qualsiasi ragione non desideri ricevere piu' messaggi da questo > indirizzo, mandami un messaggio con REMOVE nel soggetto. Mi scuso per il > disturbo. > --20cf3010e48d54cef704f3de32af Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable <div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div>Alberto, the question is not clear.=A0 When you = say "in the time domain" do you mean you are looking for alternat= ives to the widely used perceptual audio coders that use filterbanks?=A0 <b= r><br> If "<span>a spectral-weighted temporal approximation method" is w= hat you want, don't try to "</span><span>connect frequency compone= nts=A0</span><span style=3D"background-color:transparent">to specific sampl= es in the time domain".=A0 Frequency components are not a relevant con= cept in the time domain.=A0 <br> <br></span></div><span style=3D"background-color:transparent">Possibly what= you want is something like LPC whitening with residual coding.=A0 See for = example:</span><br><span style=3D"color:rgb(34,34,34);font-family:Arial,san= s-serif;font-size:13px;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;font-weight:no= rmal;letter-spacing:normal;line-height:16.12px;text-align:start;text-indent= :0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;background-col= or:rgb(255,255,255);display:inline!important;float:none">Singhal, Sharad. &= quot;High quality audio coding using multipulse LPC."<span class=3D"">= </span></span><i style=3D"color:rgb(34,34,34);font-family:Arial,sans-serif= ;font-size:13px;font-variant:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:norma= l;line-height:16.12px;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;= white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;background-color:rgb(255,255,255)">ICAS= SP</i><span style=3D"color:rgb(34,34,34);font-family:Arial,sans-serif;font-= size:13px;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-s= pacing:normal;line-height:16.12px;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-tra= nsform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;background-color:rgb(255,25= 5,255);display:inline!important;float:none">, 1990.<br> <br></span></div><span style=3D"color:rgb(34,34,34);font-family:Arial,sans-= serif;font-size:13px;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;font-weight:norm= al;letter-spacing:normal;line-height:16.12px;text-align:start;text-indent:0= px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;background-color= :rgb(255,255,255);display:inline!important;float:none">Dick<br> <br></span></div><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br><br><div class=3D"gmail_quo= te">On Tue, Mar 4, 2014 at 3:05 AM, JesterN Alberto Novello <span dir=3D"lt= r"><<a href=3D"mailto:jestern77@xxxxxxxx" target=3D"_blank">jestern77@xxxxxxxx= hoo.it</a>></span> wrote:<br> <blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1p= x #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div><div style=3D"font-size:10pt;font-famil= y:HelveticaNeue,Helvetica Neue,Helvetica,Arial,Lucida Grande,sans-serif"><d= iv> <span>Hi all,</span></div><div style=3D"font-style:normal;font-size:13px;ba= ckground-color:transparent;font-family:HelveticaNeue,'Helvetica Neue= 9;,Helvetica,Arial,'Lucida Grande',sans-serif"><span>i'm trying= to find a way to approximate the sample values of an audio waveform in tim= e domain.</span></div> <div style=3D"font-style:normal;font-size:13px;background-color:transparent= ;font-family:HelveticaNeue,'Helvetica Neue',Helvetica,Arial,'Lu= cida Grande',sans-serif"><span>I want a method that takes care of appro= ximating perceptually-relevant audio bands better than others.</span></div> <div style=3D"font-style:normal;font-size:13px;background-color:transparent= ;font-family:HelveticaNeue,'Helvetica Neue',Helvetica,Arial,'Lu= cida Grande',sans-serif"><span>Basically a spectral-weighted temporal a= pproximation method.=A0</span></div> <div style=3D"font-style:normal;font-size:13px;background-color:transparent= ;font-family:HelveticaNeue,'Helvetica Neue',Helvetica,Arial,'Lu= cida Grande',sans-serif"><span>In my head it's not clear how to con= nect frequency components=A0</span><span style=3D"background-color:transpar= ent">to specific samples in the time domain.=A0</span></div> <div style=3D"font-style:normal;font-size:13px;background-color:transparent= ;font-family:HelveticaNeue,'Helvetica Neue',Helvetica,Arial,'Lu= cida Grande',sans-serif"><span>Any DSP wizard out there with a good ide= a/papers ?</span></div> <div></div><div>Best regards</div><div>Alberto=A0</div><div><br></div><div = style=3D"font-style:normal;background-color:transparent;font-family:arial,h= elvetica,clean,sans-serif"><span style=3D"text-indent:0px;letter-spacing:no= rmal;font-variant:normal;font-style:normal;font-weight:normal;line-height:n= ormal;border-collapse:separate;text-transform:none;font-size:16px;white-spa= ce:normal;font-family:Helvetica;word-spacing:0px"><font face=3D"Arial"><fon= t color=3D"#999999"><font>|| | | ||| |=A0 ||=A0 || | ||||| || | || | ||| | = ||||| | | ||| | |||| |=A0 || ||||</font></font></font></span><span style=3D= "text-indent:0px;letter-spacing:normal;font-variant:normal;font-style:norma= l;font-weight:normal;line-height:normal;border-collapse:separate;text-trans= form:none;font-size:16px;white-space:normal;font-family:Helvetica;word-spac= ing:0px"><font face=3D"Arial"><font color=3D"#999999"><font><font><br> <span style=3D"font-size:10px">=A0</span><br></font></font></font></font></= span><span style=3D"font-weight:bold">ALBERTO NOVELLO / JesterN</span><br>s= ite: <span style=3D"font-weight:bold"><a href=3D"http://jestern.com" target= =3D"_blank">jestern.com</a></span><br> shop: <span style=3D"font-weight:bold"><a href=3D"http://jestern.bandcamp.c= om" target=3D"_blank">jestern.bandcamp.com</a></span><br>audio: <span style= =3D"font-weight:bold"><a href=3D"http://soundcloud.com/jestern" target=3D"_= blank">soundcloud.com/jestern</a></span><br> video: <span style=3D"font-weight:bold"><a href=3D"http://vimeo.com/jestern= " target=3D"_blank">vimeo.com/jestern</a></span><span style=3D"text-indent:= 0px;letter-spacing:normal;font-variant:normal;font-style:normal;font-weight= :normal;line-height:normal;border-collapse:separate;text-transform:none;fon= t-size:16px;white-space:normal;font-family:Helvetica;word-spacing:0px"><fon= t face=3D"Arial"><font color=3D"#999999"><span style=3D"text-indent:0px;let= ter-spacing:normal;font-variant:normal;font-style:normal;font-weight:normal= ;line-height:normal;border-collapse:separate;text-transform:none;font-size:= 16px;white-space:normal;font-family:Helvetica;word-spacing:0px"><font face= =3D"Arial"><font color=3D"#999999"><font><font><font><span style=3D"text-in= dent:0px;letter-spacing:normal;font-variant:normal;font-style:normal;font-w= eight:normal;line-height:normal;border-collapse:separate;text-transform:non= e;font-size:16px;white-space:normal;font-family:Helvetica;word-spacing:0px"= ><font face=3D"Arial"><font color=3D"#999999"><font><br> <span style=3D"font-size:10px">=A0</span><br>|| | | ||| |=A0 ||=A0 || | |||= || || | || | ||| | ||||| | | ||| | |||| |=A0 || ||||</font></font></font></= span><span style=3D"text-indent:0px;letter-spacing:normal;font-variant:norm= al;font-style:normal;font-weight:normal;line-height:normal;border-collapse:= separate;text-transform:none;font-size:16px;white-space:normal;font-family:= Helvetica;word-spacing:0px"></span></font></font></font></font></font></spa= n></font></font></span><span style=3D"text-indent:0px;letter-spacing:normal= ;font-variant:normal;font-style:normal;font-weight:normal;line-height:norma= l;border-collapse:separate;text-transform:none;font-size:16px;white-space:n= ormal;font-family:Helvetica;word-spacing:0px"><font face=3D"Arial"><font co= lor=3D"#AAAAAA"><br> <br></font></font></span></div><div style=3D"font-style:normal;background-c= olor:transparent;font-family:arial,helvetica,clean,sans-serif"><span style= =3D"font-size:10px">If for any reason you wish not to receive any more mess= ages from this email, please send an email with REMOVE as subject. I'm = sorry for the inconvenience. <br> </span></div><div style=3D"font-style:normal;font-size:13px;background-colo= r:transparent;font-family:arial,helvetica,clean,sans-serif"><span style=3D"= font-size:x-small">Se per qualsiasi ragione non desideri ricevere piu' = messaggi da questo indirizzo, mandami un messaggio con REMOVE nel soggetto.= Mi scuso per il disturbo.</span><br> </div></div></div></blockquote></div><br></div> --20cf3010e48d54cef704f3de32af--