Subject: Re: [AUDITORY] Offstage instruments From: Ian Cross <ic108@xxxxxxxx> Date: Mon, 18 Sep 2017 10:07:24 +0100 List-Archive:<http://lists.mcgill.ca/scripts/wa.exe?LIST=AUDITORY>This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------D4FFBA8B94F9092212725EAF Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-MIME-Autoconverted: from 8bit to quoted-printable by edgeum1.it.mcgill.ca id v8I97SQd031638 There's an offstage guitar in Berlioz's /*B=C3=A9atrice et B=C3=A9n=C3=A9= dict*/ which=20 later appears again from the orchestra pit. Best, Ian Cross On 17/09/2017 22:27, Renee Timmers wrote: > In Gluck's Orfeo ed Euridice, 2 chalumeaus and a few strings are=20 > playing off stage. > I have not checked this information, but have been told by a=20 > professional musician, who I asked about this. > > Best, > Renee > > On Sun, 17 Sep 2017 at 05:46, Arun Chandra <arunc@xxxxxxxx=20 > <mailto:arunc@xxxxxxxx>> wrote: > > I'm glad that people mentioned Mahler symphonies, but there's also = his > very first orchestral composition "Das Klagende Lied", which has an > entire orchestra and chorus offstage. > > And his 2nd symphony, in addition to having instruments offstage, a= lso > has an offstage chorus. > > arun > > On 9/16/17 9:16 AM, Jonathan Berger wrote: > > and on a very different note - Turandot which has saxophone and > organ > > backstage - an amazing timbre effect. > > - jonathan > > > > --- > > Jonathan Berger > > The Denning Family Provostial Professor in Music > > Bass University Fellow in Undergraduate Education > > Stanford University > > > > http://jonathanberger.net > > > > On 2017-09-15 11:06, Pierre Divenyi wrote: > >> I would definitely add John Cage's_ __4'33" ._ > >> > >> Pierre Divenyi > >> > >> On 9/15/17 1:02 AM, Victor Rosi wrote: > >> > >>> Mahler's 1st symphony : Offstage trumpets in the first movement > >>> Mahler's 2nd symphony : Offstage brass ensemble (horns, trumpet= s) > >>> and timpani in the last movement > >>> Alpen sinfonie (R. Strauss) : Horn ensemble in the third part (= The > >>> Ascent /Der Anstieg) > >>> > >>> You also have this kind of effects in Opera's such as Madama > >>> Butterfly (G. Puccini) : in the second Act "Coro a bocca chiusa= " > >>> there is a viola d'amore playing with a choir offstage. > >>> > >>> I hope I helped, i'll try to find other examples. > >>> > >>> Good luck and keep us updated ! > >>> > >>> Victor ROSI > >>> > >>> 2017-09-15 1:04 GMT+02:00 Niels Christian Hansen > <nch@xxxxxxxx <mailto:nch@xxxxxxxx>>: > >>> > >>>> Dear collective wisdom (with apologies for cross-posting), > >>>> > >>>> For a research project at Ohio State University, School of Mus= ic, > >>>> we are currently assembling a database of musical pieces in wh= ich > >>>> composers call for one or more instruments to be played > >>>> "offstage". > >>>> > >>>> Classic examples from the Western symphonic repertoire include= : > >>>> (1) the offstage trumpet in Ludwig van Beethoven's Leonore > >>>> Overtures Nos. 2 & 3, (2) the offstage oboe in the third movem= ent > >>>> ("Sc=C3=A8ne aux champs") from Hector Berlioz' Symphonie Fanta= stique, > >>>> and (3) the offstage female choir in "Neptune" from Gustav > Holst's > >>>> The Planets. > >>>> > >>>> We would be very grateful for your kind help in drawing our > >>>> attention to as many other examples as possible that you may b= e > >>>> aware of! > >>>> > >>>> Thanks in advance, > >>>> Niels Chr. Hansen & David Huron > >>>> > >>>> Niels Chr. Hansen (PhD, MSc, MMus) | Postdoctoral Fellow in Mu= sic > >>>> Cognition | Cognitive and Systematic Musicology > >>>> Laboratory<http://musiccog.ohio-state.edu/ [1]> | School of > >>>> Music<https://music.osu.edu/ [2]> | Ohio State > >>>> University<https://www.osu.edu/ [3]> | > >>>> hansen.491@xxxxxxxx > <mailto:hansen.491@xxxxxxxx><mailto:hansen.491@xxxxxxxx > <mailto:hansen.491@xxxxxxxx>> > >> > >> > >> > >> Links: > >> ------ > >> [1] http://musiccog.ohio-state.edu/ > >> [2] https://music.osu.edu/ > >> [3] https://www.osu.edu/ > > -- > Arun Chandra > COM 308A > The Evergreen State College > Olympia, WA 98505 > office: (360) 867-6077 > email: arunc@xxxxxxxx <mailto:arunc@xxxxxxxx> > > --=20 > > Dr Renee Timmers > Reader in Psychology of Music, Director of Graduate Studies > Department of Music, University of Sheffield > 34 Leavygreave Road, Sheffield S3 7RD > > Director of distance learning MAs in psychology of music=20 > <http://www.sheffield.ac.uk/music/prospective-pg/distance-learning> > Vice President of the European Society for the Cognitive Sciences of=20 > Music <http://www.escom.org/> > Music Mind Machine in Sheffield=20 > <http://www.sheffield.ac.uk/music/research/researchcentres/music-mind-m= achine> > > Now published: Routledge Companion to Music Cognition=20 > <https://www.routledge.com/The-Routledge-Companion-to-Music-Cognition/A= shley-Timmers/p/book/9781138721050> > > > http://ukcatalogue.oup.com/product/9780199659647.do --=20 Professor Ian Cross Director, Centre for Music & Science Faculty of Music University of Cambridge Cambridge CB3 9DP www.cam.ac.uk/~cross --------------D4FFBA8B94F9092212725EAF Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-MIME-Autoconverted: from 8bit to quoted-printable by edgeum1.it.mcgill.ca id v8I97SQd031638 <html> <head> <meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dutf= -8"> </head> <body text=3D"#000000" bgcolor=3D"#FFFFFF"> <p><font face=3D"Arial">There's an offstage guitar in Berlioz's </fon= t><i><b>B=C3=A9atrice et B=C3=A9n=C3=A9dict</b></i> which later appears again from th= e orchestra pit.</p> <p>Best,</p> <p>Ian Cross<br> </p> <br> <div class=3D"moz-cite-prefix">On 17/09/2017 22:27, Renee Timmers wrote:<br> </div> <blockquote type=3D"cite" cite=3D"mid:3504_1505723019_59BF828A_3504_910_1_CALMFsMT-3dF7fmyM_GcpWiyN= xRQh5OgX+HTecYU=3DF6kbQEJovg@xxxxxxxx"> <div> <div dir=3D"auto">In Gluck's Orfeo ed Euridice, 2 chalumeaus and = a few strings are playing off stage.=C2=A0</div> <div dir=3D"auto">I have not checked this information, but have been told by a professional musician, who I asked about this.=C2= =A0</div> <div dir=3D"auto"><br> </div> <div dir=3D"auto">Best,</div> <div dir=3D"auto">Renee=C2=A0</div> <div dir=3D"auto"><br> </div> <div class=3D"gmail_quote"> <div>On Sun, 17 Sep 2017 at 05:46, Arun Chandra <<a href=3D"mailto:arunc@xxxxxxxx" moz-do-not-send=3D"true= ">arunc@xxxxxxxx</a>> wrote:<br> </div> <blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">I'm glad that people mentioned Mahler symphonies, but there's also his<br> very first orchestral composition "Das Klagende Lied", which has an<br> entire orchestra and chorus offstage.<br> <br> And his 2nd symphony, in addition to having instruments offstage, also<br> has an offstage chorus.<br> <br> arun<br> <br> On 9/16/17 9:16 AM, Jonathan Berger wrote:<br> > and on a very different note - Turandot which has saxophone and organ<br> > backstage - an amazing timbre effect.<br> > - jonathan<br> ><br> > ---<br> > Jonathan Berger<br> > The Denning Family Provostial Professor in Music<br> > Bass University Fellow in Undergraduate Education<br> > Stanford University<br> ><br> > <a href=3D"http://jonathanberger.net" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank" moz-do-not-send=3D"true">http://jonathanb= erger.net</a><br> ><br> > On 2017-09-15 11:06, Pierre Divenyi wrote:<br> >> I would definitely add John Cage's_ __4'33" ._<br> >><br> >> Pierre Divenyi<br> >><br> >> On 9/15/17 1:02 AM, Victor Rosi wrote:<br> >><br> >>> Mahler's 1st symphony : Offstage trumpets in the first movement<br> >>> Mahler's 2nd symphony : Offstage brass ensemble (horns, trumpets)<br> >>> and timpani in the last movement<br> >>> Alpen sinfonie (R. Strauss) : Horn ensemble in the third part (The<br> >>> Ascent /Der Anstieg)<br> >>><br> >>> You also have this kind of effects in Opera's such as Madama<br> >>> Butterfly (G. Puccini) : in the second Act "Coro a bocca chiusa"<br> >>> there is a viola d'amore playing with a choir offstage.<br> >>><br> >>> I hope I helped, i'll try to find other examples.<br> >>><br> >>> Good luck and keep us updated !<br> >>><br> >>> Victor ROSI<br> >>><br> >>> 2017-09-15 1:04 GMT+02:00 Niels Christian Hansen <<a href=3D"mailto:nch@xxxxxxxx" target=3D"_bla= nk" moz-do-not-send=3D"true">nch@xxxxxxxx</a>>:<br> >>><br> >>>> Dear collective wisdom (with apologies for cross-posting),<br> >>>><br> >>>> For a research project at Ohio State University, School of Music,<br> >>>> we are currently assembling a database of musical pieces in which<br> >>>> composers call for one or more instruments to be played<br> >>>> "offstage".<br> >>>><br> >>>> Classic examples from the Western symphonic repertoire include:<br> >>>> (1) the offstage trumpet in Ludwig van Beethoven's Leonore<br> >>>> Overtures Nos. 2 & 3, (2) the offstage oboe in the third movement<br> >>>> ("Sc=C3=A8ne aux champs") from Hector Berlio= z' Symphonie Fantastique,<br> >>>> and (3) the offstage female choir in "Neptune" from Gustav Holst's<br> >>>> The Planets.<br> >>>><br> >>>> We would be very grateful for your kind help in drawing our<br> >>>> attention to as many other examples as possible that you may be<br> >>>> aware of!<br> >>>><br> >>>> Thanks in advance,<br> >>>> Niels Chr. Hansen & David Huron<br> >>>><br> >>>> Niels Chr. Hansen (PhD, MSc, MMus) | Postdoctoral Fellow in Music<br> >>>> Cognition | Cognitive and Systematic Musicology<br> >>>> Laboratory<<a href=3D"http://musiccog.ohio-state.edu/" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank" moz-do-not-send=3D"true">http://musiccog.= ohio-state.edu/</a> [1]> | School of<br> >>>> Music<<a href=3D"https://music.osu.edu/" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank" moz-do-not-send=3D"tru= e">https://music.osu.edu/</a> [2]> | Ohio State<br> >>>> University<<a href=3D"https://www.osu.edu/" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank" moz-do-not-send=3D"true">https://www.osu.= edu/</a> [3]> |<br> >>>> <a href=3D"mailto:hansen.491@xxxxxxxx" target=3D"_blank" moz-do-not-send=3D"true">hansen.491@xxxxxxxx= du</a><mailto:<a href=3D"mailto:hansen.491@xxxxxxxx" target=3D"_blank" moz-do-not-send=3D"true">hansen.491@xxxxxxxx</a>><br> >><br> >><br> >><br> >> Links:<br> >> ------<br> >> [1] <a href=3D"http://musiccog.ohio-state.edu/" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank" moz-do-not-send=3D"tru= e">http://musiccog.ohio-state.edu/</a><br> >> [2] <a href=3D"https://music.osu.edu/" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank" moz-do-not-send=3D"tru= e">https://music.osu.edu/</a><br> >> [3] <a href=3D"https://www.osu.edu/" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank" moz-do-not-send=3D"tru= e">https://www.osu.edu/</a><br> <br> --<br> Arun Chandra<br> COM 308A<br> The Evergreen State College<br> Olympia, WA 98505<br> office: (360) 867-6077<br> email: <a href=3D"mailto:arunc@xxxxxxxx" target=3D"_blan= k" moz-do-not-send=3D"true">arunc@xxxxxxxx</a><br> </blockquote> </div> </div> <div dir=3D"ltr">-- <br> </div> <div class=3D"gmail_signature" data-smartmail=3D"gmail_signature"> <div dir=3D"ltr"> <div> <div dir=3D"ltr"> <div> <div dir=3D"ltr"> <div> <div dir=3D"ltr"> <div> <div dir=3D"ltr"> <div> <div dir=3D"ltr"> <div> <div dir=3D"ltr"> <div> <div dir=3D"ltr"> <div> <div dir=3D"ltr"> <div> <div dir=3D"ltr"> <div> <div dir=3D"ltr"> <div> <div dir=3D"ltr"> <div> <div dir=3D"ltr"> <div dir=3D"ltr= "> <div dir=3D"ltr= "><br> <div>Dr Renee Timmers</div> <div><span style=3D"font-s= ize:12.8000001907349px">Reader in Psychology of Music, Director of Graduate Studies <br> Department of Music, University of Sheffield</span= > <div> <div>34 Leavygreave Road, Sheffield S3 7RD<br> </div> <br> </div> <div>Director of <a href=3D"http://= www.sheffield.ac.uk/music/prospective-pg/distance-learning" target=3D"_blank" moz-do-not-send=3D"true">distance learning MAs in psychology of music</a><br> </div> <div>Vice President of the <a href=3D"http://= www.escom.org/" target=3D"_blank" moz-do-not-send=3D"true">European Society for the Cognitive Sciences of Music</a> <br> </div> <div><a href=3D"http://www.sheffield.ac.uk/music/research/researchcentres/music-m= ind-machine" target=3D"_blank" moz-do-not-send=3D"true"><span style=3D"font-s= ize:12.8000001907349px">Music Mind Machine in Sheffield</s= pan></a><br> =C2=A0<br> </div> <div><a href=3D"https://www.routledge.com/The-Routledge-Companion-to-Music-Cognit= ion/Ashley-Timmers/p/book/9781138721050" target=3D"_blank" moz-do-not-send=3D"true">Now published: Routledge Companion to Music Cognition</a><b= r> </div> <div><br> <img src=3D"cid:imag= e002.jpg@xxxxxxxx" style=3D"font-size:12.8000001907349px" moz-do-not-send=3D"true"><br> </div> <div><span style=3D"color:= rgb(31,73,125)"><a href=3D"http://ukcatalogue.oup.com/product/9780199659647.do" style=3D"color:= rgb(17,85,204)" target=3D"_blank" moz-do-not-send=3D"true"><span style=3D"color:blue">htt= p://ukcatalogue.oup.com/product/9780199659647.do</span></a></span><br> </div> </div> </div> </div> </div> </div> </div> </div> </div> </div> </div> </div> </div> </div> </div> </div> </div> </div> </div> </div> </div> </div> </div> </div> </div> </div> </div> </div> </div> </div> </blockquote> <br> <pre class=3D"moz-signature" cols=3D"72">--=20 Professor Ian Cross Director, Centre for Music & Science Faculty of Music University of Cambridge Cambridge CB3 9DP <a class=3D"moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href=3D"http://www.cam.ac.uk/~cross= ">www.cam.ac.uk/~cross</a></pre> </body> </html> --------------D4FFBA8B94F9092212725EAF--